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[RRD]

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http://creation.reslight.net/?p=15

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[freyd]

"Graig Venter human genome mapper biologist is claiming that an artificially created organism will be successfully completed by year end that it will pave the way to better vacine production, biofuels, and toxic waste mitigation by new organisms far more modified than previous GMO creatures. You can read more here.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1208047/Life-order-Man-organisms-months-say-biologists.html#ixzz0P6qv1jOg

While this is exciting it is also very troubling as the capability to jigger the basic cellular design at will is getting closer to full design from clean sheet of paper for a totally new organism. When that happens the "Intelligent Design" Vs "Darwinist's" will be over. Once humans can create at will a complete design of an organism even a simple bacteria from "scratch", then we can no longer say that no existing organism is a totally random Darwin product because there is no way to conclusively show that none of the genetics were jiggered or "designed" by intelligent beings or agents who don't necessarily have to be Gods just have to be at least as capable as we are soon to become and hidden to history!

The irony here is that probably some even many of the very people doing this custom organism design work (intelligent designers no doubt) will be ardent Darwinist anti "Intelligent Design" believers! Won't they be suprised when they realize they have obviated their own argument for "Ran-dumb" mutational survival of the fittest."

http://www.surfingtheapocalypse.net/cgi-bin/forum.cgi?read=229842

[joyful]

JWs preach earth is not created in literal six days.  Anyone object this here or everyone agree with them.

thank you,

h

[humbleservant]

JWs preach earth is not created in literal six days.  Anyone object this here or everyone agree with them.

thank you,

h

Hello Hitomi,

I personally believe that while the majority of churches teach each creative day to be 24 hours long, that in fact it is 7000 years long. This is what the JWs teach also.

When you check out the many systems of time in the scriptures, it is quite in line with them.

If you take each creative day to be 7000yrs long, then the 6 days would amount to 42000yrs, with the 7th day a further 7000yrs, this would make the week to be 49000yrs long according to this count. To all intents & purposes, we are just into the last 1000yrs of the 7th day which began in 1975, according to chronology.

Christian love,

Ion

[The_Editor]

JWs preach earth is not created in literal six days.  Anyone object this here or everyone agree with them.

thank you,

h

Hello Hitomi,

I personally believe that while the majority of churches teach each creative day to be 24 hours long, that in fact it is 7000 years long. This is what the JWs teach also.

When you check out the many systems of time in the scriptures, it is quite in line with them.

If you take each creative day to be 7000yrs long, then the 6 days would amount to 42000yrs, with the 7th day a further 7000yrs, this would make the week to be 49000yrs long according to this count. To all intents & purposes, we are just into the last 1000yrs of the 7th day which began in 1975, according to chronology.

Christian love,

Ion

Hi Ion and Hitomi,

If I'm not mistaken, usually it is only strict fundmentalists that believe in the literal "days" concept.  Many, even conservative, churches have accepted an "indefinite" period for the "days".  In fact, I'm pretty sure the WT Society puts an infinite time possibility between "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth..." and the start of the first "day" of creation.

I think possibly there are a number of views that can still be in harmony with the Scriptures.  After all, what differentiates humans from apes or other high order mammals?  God's declaration of us as "unique" in "His image" and our ability to love and worship.

Regards, Brenden.

[ppcm]

............
I think possibly there are a number of views that can still be in harmony with the Scriptures.  ........

  Hi all,

 I agree with The_Editor's thought that a number of the views are possible and not against the the Bible. Thus I'm not dogmatic on this topic.

   regards, PPCM

[RRD]

For some clarification: Brother Russell, the JWs, and most Bible Students usually assert that the creation of the heavens and the earth spoken of in Genesis 1:1 are not part of the six days of creation, but that there may have millions, even billions of years, between the time of Genesis 1:1 and the start of the first day of creation. However, a few Bible Students have recognized that the creation of the heavens and the earth that are spoken of in Genesis 1:1 takes place during all of the six days of creation, as directly stated in Exodus 20:11; 31:17. Since the Bible directly tells us that the heavens and the earth were created in the six days, then there was no time period between the creation of the heavens and the earth of Genesis 1, but the starting point of the creation of those heavens and earth spoken of in Genesis 1:1 actually begins with the start of the first day of creation and lasts on through the sixth day of creation, even as the verses of Genesis 1 and 2 tell us.

By comparison with other scriptures, as I presented in the study, one can see, however, the creation of the material universe itself, including the creation of the planet earth, happened long before the creation of the heavens and earth spoken of in Genesis 1:1. Not only this, the creation of the spirit beings also took place before the creation of the heavens and earth of Genesis 1:1. Thus, the creation of the planet earth could have been millions, even billions, of years before the creation spoken of in Genesis 1:1.

See also other studies:
http://tinyurl.com/rl-beginningcreation

Christian love,
Ronald

[humbleservant]

Hi Ronald,

Thanks for your explanation. Yes I can readily agree with you concerning the creation account of Gen.1 as being separate from the actual creation of the planet earth & the rest of the universe.

As you say it is possible for the original creation to have taken millions or billions of years prior to the Genesis account of creation beginning.

WCL

Ion

[dreese]

What often happens in religious studies is an evolvement of the original concept done in the light of science and philosophy.

Jews find themselves with this dilemma.  The Orthodox hold two views about creation because of this natural progression.  They hold that Genesis is true and assert that God created the heavens and earth in 6 Days as it reiterates in Exodus, then they assert the truths of science in regard to creation.  Similar to the way people look at the account of the Sun standing still in Joshua's time.  The Bible is true but we know physically and from science what occured or didn't occur.

Its ok to add a new idea to an old record, it keeps things fresh.

dreese

[joyful]

Is there any problem if we interpret literal 6 days?  After all, God is almighty and anything is possible. It is no problem for Him to create the world in 6 days IMO.

h

[rus virgil]

again, we faces the way God is writting His word :
Proverbs 25:2
 2. It is the glory of God to conceal a thing; But the glory of kings is to search out a matter.

and also we are subjected to God's principle:
Deuteronomy 29:29
 29. The secret things belong unto Jehovah our God;
         but the things that are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law.

 God has told us that he "created" in six "days"
from Adam creation, the seventh day begun
there is no scriptural mention that the seventh day would have been over/or finished (until today),
so here is the proof that a "day" of creation is longer than 24 hours

but also, we were taught that a creation' day lasts 7000 years
well, this is, in fact, an interpretation
which cannot be "fully" supported by scripture

what we know "for sure" is the fact that we are living toward the end of the sixth thousand year from Adam ,
but surely  this time did not ended in 1975

regarding the chronologies from Adam until nowadays  there is a brother who studied a lot and even wrote a book regarding that
I speak about Bro. David Rice , you may ask about him

friendly, rus v.

[humbleservant]

Is there any problem if we interpret literal 6 days?  After all, God is almighty and anything is possible. It is no problem for Him to create the world in 6 days IMO.

h

Hi Hitomi,
You are quite right, YHWH is all powerful & able to do all things.

The point is though, that I am unaware of any scriptural proof that the creative days were a literal 24hours long. There are precedents set forth in scripture to give the idea of a much longer period of time.

One point of reason for this is that time was not an issue with God, He had no need of hurry in any of His works.

Another thing is that the 24hour period may not have come into effect until during the 4th creative day. Gen.1;14-19.

You see, I believe that it is a human trait to be in a hurry to do everything, the main reason for this is our short lifespan since the Noachian flood.
 
However, as God is eternal, he has no need to rush as brought out at Ps.90;4, "For a thousand years in Your sight Are like yesterday when it is past, And like a watch in the night."

Some more points to consider.
Ion

[humbleservant]

After rereading Rus's post, he therein mentions that the seventh day is not over yet.

Th Ap Paul gives what I consider reasurance of this in Heb.4;1-11.
Verse 10 sums this passage up by saying, "For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His."

This gives the impression that the 1st century church when this was written were still in God's rest at that time.

Ion

[The_Editor]

After rereading Rus's post, he therein mentions that the seventh day is not over yet.

Th Ap Paul gives what I consider reasurance of this in Heb.4;1-11.
Verse 10 sums this passage up by saying, "For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His."

This gives the impression that the 1st century church when this was written were still in God's rest at that time.

Ion

Hi Ion, Hitomi and Rus,

Interesting stuff.  Another theory from one commentator is as follows:  is that the days of Genesis 1 are not days of creation but days of revelation: the revelation theory. The days of Genesis 1 are literal days of twenty-four hours, but they are days in the life of Moses. In six days God revealed to Moses the truths concerning creation, and on each of those days Moses recorded the revelation that was given to him. The revelation theory satisfies the Hebraist who says that the Hebrew of Genesis 1 demands literal twenty-four hour days, and it satisfies the scientist who demands long periods of time for the formation of the earth.

Thought I'd share that.

Regards, Brenden.

[before time]

Greeting Brenden

Interesting stuff.  Another theory from one commentator is as follows:  is that the days of Genesis 1 are not days of creation but days of revelation: the revelation theory. The days of Genesis 1 are literal days of twenty-four hours, but they are days in the life of Moses. In six days God revealed to Moses the truths concerning creation, and on each of those days Moses recorded the revelation that was given to him. The revelation theory satisfies the Hebraist who says that the Hebrew of Genesis 1 demands literal twenty-four hour days, and it satisfies the scientist who demands long periods of time for the formation of the earth.

Sounds interesting can you send over a link on the info

God Bless

BT