According to some, there are three who share the incommunicable attritubes of God: God the Father, his Son Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. In this document, we are focusing on the attribute of eternity.

The trinitarian usually means by "eternal" or "eternity" not just they all three have an eternal future, but also that they all three have an eternal past. Most trinitarians also claim that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit exist in a realm outside of time, and this realm is eternity. Additionally, there are others who do not believe in the trinity, yet still believe that Jesus is God Almighty, and that Jesus exists either from eternity past, or in eternity outside of time.

We suggest a study of two other documents before continuing this study:
Did Jesus Have a Beginning?
Beginnings

Trinitarians usually align the scriptures something like we present below, which together are taken as proof that the Father, Jesus and the holy spirit are all eternal, and thus all three must be persons of one God, since only God is from everlasting:

Father: Psalm 90:2; ; Isaiah 57:15; Isaiah 43:10

Son: Psalm 2:7; Proverbs 8:22,23; Isaiah 9:6; Micah 5:2; John 1:1; John 8:58; 10:30; Hebrews 7:3; 13:8; Revelation 1:17,18; 22:13

Holy Spirit: Hebrews 9:14

Scriptures Pertaining to the Father

Psalm 90:2: "Before the mountains were brought forth, Or ever you had formed the earth and the world, Even from everlasting to everlasting, you are God." We know that Yahweh has an eternal past, and this is referred to in Psalm 90:2. It is our claim, however, that begettal is a form of creation, and at some point in time past, Jesus was begotten and came into being.

Isaiah 9:6: (see Isaiah 9:6 below.)

Isaiah 57:15: "For thus says the high and lofty One who inhabits eternity, whose name is Holy: I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also who is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite." This is another scripture that shows that Yahweh is eternal; although eternal past is implied here, the Hebrew word does not necessarily mean this. Some read into this that Yahweh dwells outside of time; there is nothing in the Hebrew to warrant this conclusion. The Hebrew word 'ad (Strong's 5710) is also used of the dwelling of the righteous on earth in Psalm 37:29, where no thought would be placed in dwelling outside of time. The Hebrew word is usually used of eternal future time, not of time past, but such could be implied of Yahweh, who is "from everlasting." (Psalm 41:13) Nevertheless, the New American Standard renders Isaiah 57:15 as: "For thus says the high and exalted One Who lives forever." The Hebrew word translated "lives" (Strong's #7931) simply means to dwell, reside. The Hebrew is simply saying that Yahweh dwells foever, that he lives forever.

Nevertheless, "eternity" is claimed to be a supposed incommunicable attribute of Yahweh, and thus no one else should have it. We concur that having an eternal past only belongs to Yahweh, but to live forever (as pertaining to the future) is not an incommunicable attribute of Yahweh. We gave Psalm 37:29, which shows that humans will dwell for eternity upon the earth; this certainly doesn't mean that they will share an incommunicable attribute of Yahweh. -- See also: Psalm 21:4,6; 22:26.

Isaiah 43:10: "You are my witnesses, says Yahweh, and my servant whom I have chosen; that you may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am Yahweh; and besides me there is no savior."
See: Isaiah 43:10 Study

Scriptures Pertaining to the Son

Psalm 2:7 This scripture is sometimes presented concerning the idea that Jesus is begotten in eternity, therefore that he supposedly has an eternal past even though he was begotten. The scripture actually says: "I will tell of the decree. Yahweh said to me, 'You are my son. Today I have become your father.'" Trinitarians like to stress the word "today" as meaning "eternity", as an alleged proof that Jesus is eternal. The thought evidently is that this word is supposed to mean an eternal day, and thus Jesus was supposedly begotten in eternity. Actually, the word "begotten", as used of Jesus here, proves the reverse, that he has a beginning, therefore he is not eternal, as having an eternal past. Furthermore, Paul quotes this verse three times (Acts 13:33; Hebrew 1:5; 5:5) to prove that Jesus is firstborn from the dead. (Colossians 1:18; Revelation 1:5) Therefore the expression "today" refers to the Gospel Age, not to an eternal "day" that is not limited by time. Thus the idea that this scripture presents something that proves Jesus to have been eternal becomes circular reasoning, in effect, saying: "We believe that Jesus was begotten in eternity, thus 'today' here must mean eternity, therefore this scripture shows that Jesus was begotten in eternity." Actually, there is nothing in this scripture that indicates that Jesus was begotten in eternity.

See also: Psalm 2:7: When Is This Fulfilled?

Proverbs 8:22,23: "Yahweh possessed me in the beginning of his work, Before his deeds of old. I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, Before the earth existed." The thought many present from these verses is that Jesus is "from everlasting" and that this means that he has always existed, that he had an eternal past, just as Yahweh, since a similar expression is used of Yahweh in Psalm 90:2.

However, the American Standard Version has a marginal reading on the word, possessed: "or, formed". The Jewish Publication Society reads: "The LORD made me as the beginning of His way." The Revised Standard Version reads: "The LORD created me at the beginning of his work, the first of his acts of old. Prov 8:23: Ages ago I was set up, at the first, before the beginning of the earth." Rotherham's Version reads: "Yahweh, had constituted me the beginning of his way, before his works, at the commencement of that time; At the outset of the ages, had I been established, in advance of the antiquities of the earth." Evidently there is some room for reckoning on how this should be translated in harmony with the rest of the scriptures. If the latter translations are accepted, rather than proving that Jesus had no beginning, they rather prove that Jesus was created. Please note also the JPS rendering of verse 30: "Then I was by Him, as a nursling." If this rendering is correct, it implies that the Logos' development under Yahweh's training. Such training at Yahweh's hands would have been impossible had he been co-eternal, consubstantial and co-equal with Yahweh.

We have discussed these verses in greater detail in a separate document, which we encourage you to study:

Proverbs 8:22

Isaiah 9:6: "For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be on his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." Some point to the expression "everlasting father" in this verse and claim this means that Jesus is "eternal father." The CARM states concerning this: "When Isaiah 9:6 says that Jesus' name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, etc., it is not saying that Jesus is the eternal Father, but that he has the characteristics of God. In other words, Jesus has all the attributes of God, including eternality."* Of course, this idea has to be read into what is said here. In reality, nothing is said about Yahweh's Anointed One having an eternity past. The scripture says that his name shall, will, be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty EL, Everlasting Father, etc., pointing to a future time. As we have shown in our study of this verse, this title points to the millennial age when Jesus brings the human race back to life. Jesus will be the everlasting father to the human race forever (future). Any idea of an eternal past has to be read into what is said.

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*http://www.carm.org/oneness/Father.htm

One trinitarian author writes:

God the Father is seen in the Scriptures to be supreme over all in the Godhead. He is the "Father of our Lord Jesus Christ," and, "Our Father which art in heaven" -- the "Father of eternity" [Isaiah 9:6, marg. R.V.]
--- James McRobbie, What the Bible Teaches - A Guide to Total Christian Commitment, Pillar of Fire, International
http://www.belleview-college.org/bible/CourseFour_ht,.htm

Likewise another trinitarian writes: "According to Isaiah 9:6, the Father is the eternal Father." This is a misuse of scripture. Isaiah 9:6 is a prophecy concerning Yahweh's Anointed -- Messiah, not concerning Yahweh; to quote it as though it is speaking of the Father of Jesus is to quote it out of context.

The claim is made that the Father is the eternal father, and thus this means that he has always been a father for all eternity past. In actuality, there is no scripture that says that Yahweh has always been a father in all eternity past; such an idea has to be read into the scriptures. Even if there were a scripture that says that Yahweh is the eternal father, it would not mean that he has always been a father; it would only mean that at some point in time he became father to Jesus and that for all future he is the Father of Jesus. In this light, Yahweh is thus the "Eternal Father" of Jesus, the church, and all creation.

See also our study: Everlasting Father

Micah 5:2: "But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, Being small among the clans of Judah, Out of you one will come forth to me that is to be ruler in Israel; Whose goings forth are from of old, from everlasting." We have dealt with this scripture extensively in a separate document, so will not spend too much time on it here. We will only present here alternate renderings: "But thou, Beth-lehem Ephrathah, which art little to be among the thousands of Judah, out of thee shall one come forth unto Me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth are from of old, from ancient days." (Jewish Publication Society) "Thou, therefore, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though, little, to be among the thousands of Judah, out of thee, shall Mine come forth, to be ruler in Israel,—whose comings forth, have been from of old, from the days of age-past time." (Rotherham) "And thou, Beth-Lehem Ephratah, Little to be among the chiefs of Judah! From thee to Me he cometh forth--to be ruler in Israel, And his comings forth are of old, From the days of antiquity." (Young's Literal Translation) "But you, O Bethlehem Ephrathah, are only a small village in Judah. Yet a ruler of Israel will come from you, one whose origins are from the distant past." (New Living Translation) "But you, O Bethlehem of Ephrathah, who are one of the little clans of Judah, from you shall come forth for me one who is to rule in Israel, whose origin is from of old, from ancient days." (New Revised Standard Version) "But you, O Bethlehem Eph'rathah, who are little to be among the clans of Judah, from you shall come forth for me one who is to be ruler in Israel, whose origin is from of old, from ancient days." (Revised Standard Version) "The Lord says, 'Bethlehem Ephrathah, you are one of the smallest towns in Judah, but out of you I will bring a ruler for Israel, whose family line goes back to ancient times.'" (Good News translation) "But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are too small to be among the army groups from Judah, from you will come one who will rule Israel for me. He comes from very old times, from days long ago." (New Century Version) "You, Bethlehem Ephrathah, are too small to be included among Judah's cities. Yet, from you Israel's future ruler will come for me. His origins go back to the distant past, to days long ago." (God's Word translation) "And you, Beth-lehem Ephrathah, the least among the families of Judah, out of you one will come to me who is to be ruler in Israel; whose going out has been purposed from time past, from the eternal days." (Bible in Basic English) "And thou, Beth-Lehem Ephratah, Little to be among the chiefs of Judah! From thee to Me he cometh forth -- to be ruler in Israel, And his comings forth [are] of old, From the days of antiquity." (Young's Literal Translation)

For more detailed study, see our document:
Micah 5:2

John 1:1: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." For a study on various renderings of John 1:1, see our document on John 1.) What we will consider here briefly is the desire of some to see "eternity" in the word "beginning". Many "read into" this that the Logos was always with God from eternity past. They seem to read the word "was" to mean that before the beginning spoken of, Jesus always "was", but this is not what is said; one has to read this into what John said. All it actually says is that the Logos was already existing at the beginning of the world of mankind, spoken of in verse 10. Jesus existed "before the beginning of the earth" (Proverbs 8:23, RSV), but this does not mean that he has always existed. We see no logical extension that would demand "always" before the beginning spoken of; since the Logos was not the God with whom he was with, that is, the only one who has existed from eternity past, then the logical conclusion is that the Logos was created before the beginning spoken of.

The context indicates that John 1:1 refers to the same beginning as in Genesis 1:1, which refers to the beginning of things pertaining to the physical earth and mankind (including all six days of creation), and not the creation of the spirit world or even of the stars and planet systems. (We should take note that there is a single "day" of creation spoken of in Genesis 2:4, which "day" includes "six days" in which he created the heavens [skies] and the earth [land masses]. -- Exodus 20:13; see also Matthew 19:4,5, which refers to the "beginning" when Adam and Eve were created.)

Thus the Logos, the Word, existed with God his Father before the beginning of earth's creation. (John 17:5) He was both the first created, being the first begotten of the Father -- the first that the Father gave life to, as well as the first or highest in rank.

For further information, see our document on: John 1:1-3

John 8:58 : See our document: "I am" in John 8:58

John 10:30: "I and the Father are one." Very evidently there is nothing here about Jesus having an eternal past, thus such an idea has to be read into what is being said. A more detailed discussion of John 10:30 can be found in our document: John 10:30

Hebrews 7:3: See our document: Is Melchizedek an Eternal Priest?

Hebrews 13:8: "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." The word yesterday, which is claimed to teach a past eternity for Jesus, actually contradicts the idea of duration without beginning, or existence outside of time. A yesterday simply reflects a day before the present day. But a day has a beginning; so has a yesterday. A day, in the Bible as well in everyday speech, does not always mean a 24-hour day based on the rotation of the earth. The word "day" sometimes signifies an indefinite time, or a set period of time. (Genesis 2:4; Isaiah 22:5; 2 Corinthians 6:2; Hebrews 3:8, etc.) The days spoken of here are evidently period of time, or ages. The Greek word translated "forever" literally means "to the ages" (Young's Literal Translation). This latter expression relates to all ages to come, and does express future eternity in that sense. But in relation to the ages to come, "today" would refer to the Gospel age, the age we are now in, the day of salvation for the church. (2 Corinthians 6:2) Earlier in the book of Hebrews Paul contrasts the present "day" with that of the Israelites. (Hebrews 3:7,13; 4:7) Thus "yesterday" in this context would refer to the Jewish Age. (Isaiah 65:2; Romans 10:21; Hebrews 4:7-10) Whether this application is correct or not, there is nothing in the word "yesterday" that means an eternal past. Such an idea has to be read into what is said.

Related Documents Written by Others
We do not necessarily agree with all statements written.

In the Beginning -- Herald of Christ's Kingdom

Far Above All Principality A verse-by-verse study of Hebrews 1 -- Herald of Christ's Kingdom

Revelation 1:17,18: "When I saw him, I fell at his feet like a dead man. He laid his right hand on me, saying, "Don't be afraid. I am the first and the last, and the Living one. I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. I have the keys of Death and of Hades." Many trinitarians say that the phrase "first and last" means that Jesus had no beginning and no ending. Such a thought has to be read into what Jesus said. The context shows that Jesus is speaking about being the first to be raised by God from the dead to everlasting life, and the last of such. All others raised will be raised through the Son of God, to whom God has given life in himself to give to others, the keys of death and hades. -- John 5:21,22-29; Revelation 20:13.

A great study of this verse is presented in our document entitled: Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last.

Revelation 22:13: "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End." This scripture is quoted with the claim that Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega, and that this means that Jesus is eternal: present, future and past. Actually, there is nothing said here about Alpha having the meaning of eternity past or Omega having the meaning of eternity past. Indeed, more than likely these words were spoken by the Father, not Jesus. "Alpha" stands for the first of something and "Omega" stands for the last of something. Of course, Yahweh is the first and last as far as being uncreated, and Jesus is the first and the last of Yahweh's direct creation. This scripture is discussed in more detail in our document on Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last.

Scriptures Pertaining to the Holy Spirit

Hebrews 9:14: The scripture presented to show that the holy spirit is eternal is Hebrews 9:14: "how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without blemish to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?" Although this scripture does not show that God's spirit has always existed, it does show that God's spirit is now eternal. However, we have no qualms about the holy spirit as having always existed, since it is in a sense part of God himself.

After a thorough study of the scriptures that trinitarians use to supposedly support the idea that Jesus has an eternal past, we find that there really is not such scripture. The idea has to be read into all the scriptures presented, and then once the idea is read into the scriptures, the scripture is used to prove the idea that is read into the scripture, which is circular reasoning.

Last update: November, 2003.

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