Scriptures supposed to support the trinity concept:
Father: Psalm 36:9; John 5:26; Exodus 3:14
Son: John 1:4; John 5:26; John 8:58; 10:17,18; Hebrews 7:3
Spirit: John 3:8; 1 Corinthians 12:11; Romans 8:2

According to our trinitarian neighbors, "self-existence" means that one is not dependent on another for life. Of course, we concede that Yahweh is self existent, and that he depends on no one else for life. However, we do not know of any scripture that says that this is an incommunicable attribute, that is, that only Yahweh can possess the attribute of self-existence. Some add to the meaning of "self-existence" the thought that such a life was never created or ever began by any outside force. With this added thought we would agree that such an attribute would only belong to Yahweh; but the question remains: is Jesus, the Son of God, also self-existent, so that this would prove that Jesus is in reality on the only true God, Yahweh (Jehovah)?

John 1:4: The first scripture presented is John 1:4, especially referring to the part: "In him was life." The assumption is that this means that the Logos was self-existent, not depending on anyone else for life. Of course, the scripture does not say that, and one has to read such a thought into what John says here. Viewed from the punctuation provided by New Revised Standard Version and some other translations, in context this reads: "All things came into being through him, and without him not one thing came into being. What has come into being in him was life, and the life was the light of all people. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not overcome it." This is different from the punctuation given by the King James Version. We will examine the NRSV rendering first. It should be apparent from this rendering that "in him was life" does not refer to "self-existence" but rather that in some manner the life being spoken of came into being through him, or is to come through him. We are first told that "all things" came into being through him. The "all things" referred to are the things of the world of mankind, and not "all things" in the universe, as many wish to read this to mean. It is the world of mankind that was made through him, and which world he came into and was not recognized by. (John 1:10) John writes then that without him not one came into being. Then, according to this rendering, John tells us that what has come into being respecting mankind was life. This could be referring back to the original creation, that what came into being was the life of the world of mankind. However, other scriptures gives us the thought that this is concerning future life for mankind in Jesus, and this, we believe, is what is meant concerning life in Jesus. John 1:4 tells us that the Logos was the light of men. Jesus brought life and incorruption to light through the gospel. (2 Timothy 1:9, 10) He did this by total obedience to God, being the first human to thus merit life, thus he has brought life to light for the human race, providing the light of hope for all people. That this in reference to his humanity, and not his prehuman existence is shown by the fact that the light shines in the darkness, but the darkness did not overcome it. Jesus said: "As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world." (John 9:5, New King James Version) Thus, this pertains to when he came into the world that was made through him, which world, because of darkness did not recognize him. (John 1:10) Jesus, as the bearer of life, became the light of the world through the life in his humanity, which life he gave up as a ransom sacrifice for the world of mankind. The King James Version and many other translations put the period differently, making John say: "All things were made through him. Without him was not anything made that has been made. In him was life, and the life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness hasn't overcome it." Again, "in him was life" refers to his life on earth, which life shone as light in the darkness of this present evil world, but was not overcome by it. See also John 1

Regardless, there is nothing in this thought of life being in him that means that Jesus is self-existent, or that Jesus is Yahweh. Such a thought would have to read into what is said.

John 5:26: The next scripture presented is John 5:26: "For as the Father has life in himself, even so he gave to the Son also to have life in himself." On the surface, and with trinitarian philosophy in mind, this appears to be saying that God Almighty -- the Father -- has given self-existence to the Son. If so, it is still something that the Son did not possess before it was given to him, and thus rather than proving that Jesus is God Almighty, it proves the opposite. Many Bible Students have also assumed that "life in himself" means that God gave to Jesus "self-existence". It has also been assumed from this that those who become joint-heirs will also become "self-existent" with Jesus. Such would make Jesus and the 144,000 joint-heirs equal to God Almighty, but this contradicts several other scriptures, so we need to look closer at what Jesus is saying here.

Jesus in context is not talking about a self-existent life that he himself possesses, but rather he is speaking of his being given by his God and Father the ability to raise and judge the dead. In other words, the Almighty has given to Jesus life in himself to impart to others. This is what Jesus says in John 6:40,47,48,50,51,54,57, etc. As Jesus lives by means of the Father, so those who feed upon Jesus will live by means of him. (John 6:57) We see nothing in any of this that Jesus is claiming to be God Almighty, or equal to God Almighty, but rather just the opposite. (Matthew Henry, while not totally in harmony with our view, does present a similar meaning for "life in himself".)

Even if Jesus did mean that he possessed self-existence, it still would not mean that Jesus is Yahweh, since this is given to Jesus by Yahweh, and thus it would mean that there was a time that Jesus was not self-existent. One trinitarian objects that "when the human nature was united to the Divine nature in one Divine Person (Colossians 1:19, 2:9), the Son of man was given to experience Divine union in a way in which no other human has ever, or will ever experience." While we have no doubt that Jesus, as a human, enjoyed a relationship with the Father that no other human has ever had, we do not believe that there is any scripture that says that Jesus possesses the "nature" of the Supreme Being, as given by trinitarian definition. We are also told by a trinitarian that "the Father is eternal, then He has always begotten the Son. There was never a time when He did not give the Son to have life in Himself. Therefore, the Son is eternally self-existent. When you speak of eternal beings, you cannot define 'given' within the framework of time." There is nothing in the Bible that says that Jesus is in some kind of eternal stasis of being begotten or being given anything. All of this has to be conjured up and added to scripture. Since the Bible says nothing of the sort that the trinitarian assumes, there is no scriptural reason to believe this.

John 8:58 is discussed in our study: "I Am" in John 8:58 and Other Scriptures

John 10:17: The next scripture presented is John 10:17,18: "Therefore the Father loves me, because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. No one takes it away from me, but I lay it down by myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. I received this commandment from my Father.” According to our trinitarian neighbor, Jesus has power to dispense and power to receive life at will, and is thus self-existent. Of course, the scripture is not talking about dispensing life and receiving life at will, but rather that Jesus has authority to lay down his own life, and also authority to receive it again. Nothing is said that Jesus can die and come back to life whenever he should chose to, as some have claimed.

Based on the English translation as it appears in most translations, many trinitarians and oneness believers claim that since only God could raise up Christ and thus if Jesus could lay down his life and take it up again he must be God. This of course, contradicts John 17:1,3, in which Jesus proclaimed that the Father is the only true God, and contrasts himself as the one sent by the one true God.

Whatever power or authority Jesus had in this regard, we must agree that this authority or power was received from the Father. "This commandment have I received from my Father." -- See Matthew 28:18.

The Greek word translated "received" in this sentence is Strong's #2983, which the King James Version translates as "receive" 133 times, and as "take" 106 times. In our passage this same word is earlier translated "take" in most translations: "Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I may take [Strong's 2983, receive] it again. No man taketh [not 2983, but Strong's #142, take] it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take [Strong's #2983] it again. This commandment have I received [Strong's #2983] from my Father."

The Greek word *lambano* (Strong's #2983) is not as strong as the Greek word *airo* (Strong's #142) and is not as personal in action as *airo*. While the word *lambano* can mean "take", it is not *necessarily* the result of one's own action, but most often results from the action of another. See the usage of both words and how they are translated in the *King James Version* by consulting *The Englishman's Greek Concordance of the New Testament* or by visiting:
http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/grk.cgi?number=2983
http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/grk.cgi?number=142

The text should be therefore be translated: "Therefore my Father does love me, because I lay down my life, that I might receive it again. No man takes it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to receive it again. This commandment I have received from my Father." Thus this passage shows that Jesus receives his life again from his Father, the only true God, in agreement with Acts 2:24; 3:15,26; 4:10; 5:30; 10:40; 13:34,37; 17:31; Romans 4:24; 8:11; 10:9; 1 Corinthians 6:14; 15:15; 2 Corinthians 4:14; Galatians 1:1; Ephesians 1:20; Colossians 2:12; 1 Thessalonians 1:10; 1 Peter 1:21.

Rotherham renders John 10:18: "No one forced it from me, but I lay it down of myself, — Authority have I to lay it down, and authority have I again to receive it: This commandment received I from my Father."

The New English Bible renders the passage this way: "The Father loves me because I lay down my life, to receive it back again. No one has robbed me of it; I am laying it down of my own free will. I have the right to lay it down, and I have the right to receive it back again; this charge I have received from my Father."

Interestingly, the New Living Translation renders verse 17: "The Father loves me because I lay down my life that I may have it back again." But it renders verse 18: "No one can take my life from me. I lay down my life voluntarily. For I have the right to lay it down when I want to and also the power to take it again. For my Father has given me this command."

The Good News Bible in Today's English does similarly: "The Father loves me because I am willing to give up my life, in order that I may receive it back again. No one takes my life away from me. I give it up of my own free will. I have the right to give it up, and I have the right to take it back. This is what my Father has commanded me to do."

Who did raise Jesus from the dead? Jesus himself was dead and in hades for parts of three days. He could not literally raise himself from the dead for he was dead. The dead are unconscious and cannot raise themselves from the dead.
see http://reslight.net/l-life.html
and
http://godandson.reslight.net/body-temple.html"
"Did Jesus Raise Himself From the Dead?"

The Bible plainly tells us that it was God, that raised Jesus from the dead. -- Acts 2:24,32,26; 3:15; 4:10; 10:40; 13:30,33,37; 17:31; Romans 4:24; 8:11; 10:9; 1 Corinthians 6:14; 15:15; Galatians 1:1; Colossians 2:11,12; 1 Thessalonians 1:9,10; 1 Peter 1:21; 3:18

Hebrews 7:3 is discussed separately. See: Is Melchizedek an Eternal Priest?

John 3:8: "The wind blows where it wants to, and you hear its sound, but don't know where it comes from and where it is going. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit." The thought of our trinitarian neighbors in quoting this scripture seems to be that if the holy spirit can give one life, then the holy spirit must be self-existent. While there is nothing in the scriptures that would lead one to believe that giving birth means that the one who giving birth is self-existent, the holy spirit, being an extension of God, has its existence in God himself who is himself self-existent.

Some see in this scripture that the holy spirit has volition, the power of choosing or determining, and thus claim that this means that the holy spirit is a person. This idea depends on a surface reading the subject of the phrase "blows where it wants to" as the holy spirit, but this is not actually what Jesus said. The subject of the phrase is "the wind", not the holy spirit. If such would be taken as a proof of its having volition and thus being a person, it would in effect be proving that the wind is a person, not the holy spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:11: "But the one and the same Spirit works all of these, distributing to each one separately as he desires." The same spirit of God, the same influence of God, works all these. There is nothing here about self-existence, but this scripture is often used to support the claim that the holy spirit is a person, because of the phrase "as he desires." The holy spirit, however, is an extension of Yahweh and thus God, through his spirit, does distribute to each one separately as he desires.

Romans 8:2: "For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus made me free from the law of sin and of death." Again, the thought of trinitarians and some others seems to be that since the holy spirit is referred to as "Spirit of life" that this somehows means self-existence. We do not doubt that the holy spirit is self-existent, but not as a separate person, but as it is an extension of God who is self-existent.

Last update: April, 2004.